Inherent Weight Advantages - A Discussion.

Thing is, a single alpha could kill you in a 1v1 battle...

 

guys I just realized what the real issue is here.. POWER CREEP

Actually I don't think the commando should be much stronger, instead I'd nerf some mechs to cap the power creep before it gets out of hand.
The FS9-A is a little bit too strong, as is the 5ss, most of the clanners (lynx and fenris, adder and kitfox are fine or even underpowered).

As I said it would be enough to nerf torso twist on the TBRs just to name an example, and I love Fehrot's suggestions

there ARE ways to handle this situation

 

That's a very dangerous path because by definition that means that ultimately only 100 ton mechs should be chosen because why bother taking a light medium or heavy if a 100 ton assault is the only mech worth piloting. That's a very boring game where you just chase the lowest common denominator.

 

Power creep is part of the issue, but just bad mechs are the other part.

I like the idea of a quirk system which is more generic (it affects all weapons or none) and which gives different mechs different feels. Extra internal structure on mechs that should be armored (awesome, centurion shield arm), mobility in various areas, etc.

I still say health/armor is the best thing they can do. I said it BEFORE ghost heat and I still say it. If all health, armor, and ammo values doubled (except maybe head), the game would balance out a lot better. At that point, mechs like a Jenner with 6 MLs would start to see that maybe something with 3 to 4 lasers and more DHS is better.

I seriously think increasing TTL would lower the randomness and balance the game better than anything else so far. Make burst damage about doing a burst and escaping, and sustained damage about constant harassment. It would also get rid of those random times when you take a single LPL to the back in a light and just keel over.

 

My argument for why its worth piloting the lesser quality mechs is that ultimately if I beat you in one then I'm unequivocally a better pilot than you are.

I'd take it one step further and say if all you ever pilot is the best build then as a pilot you're playing easy mode and you never develop.

 

Isn't it why we all play FPS games to prove we're better than our opponents, even our friends and allies?

If you see someone you know on the other side don't you REALLY want to beat them?

Edit: Come on don't you feel a moment of vindication when you kill someone in a "shit" mech?

 

I do feel that moment of vindication.

However, in terms of game balance, there should be no "junk mechs" unless there is something you gain for having a junk mech.

 

I also enjoy beating people in my subpar mechs like keeping up with the timber wolves in my summoner or playing my dragon and out scoring the top tier guys with min max builds.

But at the end of the day if you want to maximize your chances to win you have to be limited to the few choices of 'Meta' mechs and builds for serious matches and such...

I agree 200% with doubling mech armor all around. Especially with clan tech, 12v12 and quirk system. It's too bursty right now.

 

No thanks taking down a Timberwolf in my Locust is already hard enough....

 

This would certainly be interesting, would love to test it in a Public Test. However I feel like this would make many situations worse.

 

But, Falcy... you're not normal...

 

Well doesn't necessarily have to be doubled but as was said taking a 6ML bursty Jenner vs considering 4 ML and more DHS for longer attrition sounds more along the lines of what I imagine.

 

Basically I wouldn't want high alpha builds to just blow through someone so fast that they are the only option for min/max.

If overheating mattered more for all situations, it would nerf most alpha builds.

 

Haw. The armor is doubled already as it is, from the tabletop boardgame version of Battletech.

 

I would agree on the 5SS, though not as much on the FS9-A...mainly because it's a mech that has situational strength inside 150 meters, and utterly is powerless outside about 250, whereas the 5SS has a much wider window of operation with its extended range MPLs. Against teams that know how to prevent its approach, it can be negated far easier, or taken down quickly enough to keep it from doing too much harm.

The biggest problem with the lightest of the lights in MWO has always been the same: Cryengine starts bugging out when things move too quickly across the maps. The ideal function of something like a Locust (or Flea?) is that you could put something like a MASC system on it, and let it zip across the field far faster than any other mech could possibly go, making it the perfect scouting and spotting mech. However, since we have not (and perhaps will never) get MASC due to the inherent bugginess of Cryengine, it instantly screws up one of the best potential abilities of the class: true role warfare in creating a 200+ KPH scouter. It's made worse by the fact that, even if you could get to that speed without it bugging out, the terrain and movement style of our mechs is such that they would be continually getting air from the smallest bumps. While fall damage is such that it wouldn't tear their legs up (except on steeper hills), it would still slow them down, making them easier targets.

That's before looking at the other problem: PGI has still made a system where, in most cases, damage is king. You might be able to get some personal rewards for scouting and such, but your true value to the team is related to how well you can assist your team in doing straight damage and kills to the opposition. Some niche builds can pull off support roles (3L and KFX NARCers, for instance), but they require a very specific team setup to excel, and in PUG play can be next to worthless if you're having bad luck at finding LRMboats. They become enemy markers, and nothing more.

If the worst mechs of every weight class want to have a chance, they need something more than quirks to make them worth playing for most people, they need actual differences that make them useful in a competitive match. Way back when we discussed quirks we wanted to see, a lot of us made posts about unique quirks for each mech chassis, things like increased sensor range, turn ability, target retention, and so on. All things that could give those mechs power, despite their limited armament. That's what we need to see happen.

 

I agree. I think the quirk system should also be more generic, so if you get weapon quirks it applies to ALL weapons. Why should something get bonuses specifically to medium pulse lasers? Why not apply to all weapons.

And? There are multiple issues with time to live (TTL) being too short. It makes big hits spikier, it means burst damage is king, and it plays a part in why people are scared to push. Brawlers would be stronger if they had more of their mech left after closing into brawl range; slow, sustained builds would catch up to high bursty builds if they had a chance...and there would be a lot less people who peek over the hill, get cored, and hide the rest of the match.

Increase armor and/or structural health, and TTL goes down. The other option is to reduce damage across the board, which I don't think would work considering how equipment is named. The problem with short TTL is that it doesn't feel like I'm in a scores-ton Mech with a dozen tons of armor. I feel like I'm just wearing a power suit.

 

The problem with comparing to TT, regarding armor and weapons, is that in TT you can't focus fire on a component. Where you hit is based on what you roll. So with an AC/20, your second shot might not hit the same spot.

In-game, you have a lot more control over where your rounds go, and the better the shot you are the easier it is. This is why high pinpoint alpha reigns so much in-game.