Lights for Assault Pilots...

Ok here is the deal. I remember reading through the thread about an Assault mech for a light pilot and it got me thinking... how about the other way around. I am pretty much a dedicated assault pilot, mostly 100 tonners, and the few lights I have I can barely break 100 points damage with in most games. So for thoughs of us used to running the walking gun platforms how the hell do you pilot thoughs little paper armored pop guns and do any damage?

 

I really REALLY hate to sound judgy but Assault Mechs are the banner vehicle of the 13 year old screaming swearing cheese ball eating kid that lives in moms basement; or those who don't have situational awareness and skills required to pilot anything faster and lighter. The philosophy is simple; mount as many weapons on a platform as you can and hope like hell you kill the enemy before they kill you.. You will see competitive players pilot these regularly because of the sheer firepower you can mount that kills anything less in seconds. Point and click. BORING!

Assault mechs, in my opinion, are far more forgiving and require much less skill. You basically romp in to the fray and shoot as much as you can as fast as you can; absorb damage and hope like hell you walk out on the other side. Yes, you have to be able to aim and you have to be able to judge whether to commit to a battle or not because once you are there you aren't going anywhere fast.

Light mechs require much more skill and on the fly thinking. Because of the speed, and lack of armor, you need to be able to judge not only your approach vector but your route of egress as well. All of that happens BEFORE you engage the enemy, while moving at 150+ kph, with rice paper for armor. You also need to be able to assess who the most damaged enemy is and who you have the best chance of killing quickly during that few brief seconds on an attack pass. That is just for the purely combat driven light pilot... This is a great place to start. For instance the Jenner D or even the Jenner F. Fast, decent offensive capability and decent armor for a light. Jump Jets will add a new dimension for you to play in too.

Then there is the flip side; the sniper/surgeon/technician who will vector approach unseen, using ECM and then blow off the components that are most heavily damaged. Plan his next position and move to that station. All the while knowing other lights are out there hunting him.

Every time I've piloted an assault mech I feel invincible and I hope like hell my weapons don't jam or I have enough ammo but I really don't care if I'm taking fire from an Atlas or a DireDouche because chances are I'm chewing him up just as quickly. I rumble to the fight and hold the trigger down hoping like hell it doesn't jam the 4x UAC5s I'm running or that my Stalker has enough LRM ammo to rain the pain.

 

Lights can run. Lights can bob and weave. An assault pilot doesn't just need situational awareness - they need complete prescient knowledge. The good pilot knows he will get cut down if he makes a mistake, because he can't reposition.

...this is why I stick to heavies and mediums. I get too gun crazy in assaults unless I'm very focused. Lights.... I guess I don't do enough cocaine to enjoy them.

 

I would both agree and disagree with Michael's post, in that my general opinion is that the hardest mechs in the game to learn are both assaults AND lights. It's just that they are hard for their own reasons.

Assault mechs are difficult because of their movement abilities: they are slow, so a single misstep (or a bad team abandoning you...or you not noticing a move and being abandoned) is all it takes to end your run. Light mechs, conversely, are also difficult because of their unique disadvantages: with a few exceptions, they don't have much firepower, and disintegrate in no time if they take an alpha, sometimes in one shot. You could make arguments for either one to be the weaker of the two, because that designation generally changes from match to match.

The biggest problems I see light pilots having is that they do not stay mobile, or do not have their mechs fully prepared before the match...for example, I ran into a stock Jenner-F and Firestarter-H during a group queue match the other day. They were obviously not ready for a real match, their mechs were too slow, too poorly equipped, and too lightly armored compared to what a fully upgraded version would have been. They also showed every hallmark of a new light player: stopping often, running in straight lines, etc. Lights have the potential to be the most dangerous and lethal mechs on the battlefield, however they are also far more unforgiving than Assault mechs: a single mistake can cost you your mech's torso, or leg, or half their weapons. Catching a single lucky gauss can end your run at 0 damage, whereas an Assault can shrug off a few slugs here and there.

Playing a light is a matter of attrition: you have to simply keep failing upward until you find that sweet spot of playstyle that allows you to survive. My suggestion would be to start with lights that have JJs (Jenner, Spider, Firestarter) and play them until you start to understand how it works. More importantly, whenever you die, watch the rest of the game and spectate your team's lights...and if they are dead, spectate your assaults, and watch how enemy light mechs move around them. Doing so will slowly begin to teach you the better habits of playing those mechs.

 

Thanks for the input so far!
I have been trying the whole learn from thy enemy thing by copying there tactics and the like but it os not working so well. I am currently running commandos and a spider-D I think. The Mandos are cannon fodder if you are seen and the spider, even though it has ecm, gets targeted more than my AS7-D-DC! I started trying to play a light like I do my T-Bolts and started doing better but still die way to early or am the last one alive. I just run through the enemy and cause havoc, seem to get killed pretty easy but at least I was having fun when I did. Oh well never liked sniping anyway and midrange doesn't seem to be an option.

 

Jenners are quite out of favor. CSSRM, lack of quirks, and general power creep all work against the Jenner compared to a tanky FS9 or SDR, or the not even getting shot RVN.

If you're looking to pick up lights, you simply must do FS9 first. The non-ECM SDRs and RVNs are trash (except the RVN hero). FS9-A, S, and H, are all Cbill purchaseable, run an XL295, and give a variety of gameplays. Assassin, skirmisher, and harasser respectively.

Commandos and Locusts are simply hard mode. They are too light to see public play, and no leagues call for an average weight to be under 35 tons.

 

I forgot to mention, you should look at Epikt's video thread on this forum. He has plenty of matches recorded in his lights, and they are very good instructionals on how to move and shoot.

 

And lets not forget @Durandal 's as I've learnt more about certain maps from his than anyone elses.

Not so keen on the blanket description of “lights” in this thread as there are distinct different play styles based on weapon loadout.

I strangely find many of the better lights more forgiving to pilot than assaults as they have the speed, mobility and profile to easily get into cover or fade away if unsupported. They do benefit hugely from good map knowledge and continuous use however – not my strengths so if I can routinely get high damage then anyone can!

Assaults you have to utterly commit to a move and have no ability to easily relocate – it’s literally a do or die approach on every roll of the dice. I find them quite easy to adjust back to in terms of their firepower and playstyle but tactically I find it harder to quickly adjust to that judgement on if to commit or not as its easy to get mobbed and have no escape when unsupported.

On the other hand the worse lights need more time to re-adjust back to as they run with a very different mindset – is that mech unsupported and can I take him 1 v 1? It’s an experience and instinct call but at least you have a good chance to escape when your target calls on comms for assistance and everyone converges on you!

At the other end of the playstyle range are the ERLL lights who I find generally have one of the easiest roles in the game but run in specific mechs which are exceptional in that role (e.g. my Raven 3L with ECM, high weapon points and great profile when peeping). Maintain range and don’t let things get close sort of sums them up. That said they massively benefit from good map knowledge and adventurous testing of locations to snipe from so there’s a clear difference between players who use them a lot and (nowadays) occasional players like me.

Things went rather unbalanced with the quirks and packs of brawling energy lights (FS9-A’s etc) can now just mob targets taking them down ridiculously fast with their improved range, cooldown, heat generation and duration. Of course they’re also great fun to play and great c-bill generators so popular!

Overall I’m not that sure any top tier mechs in game are hard to play but people often champion their preferred mechs as “harder” in some way. Hint – they just play differently.

Of course the shit lights are awful but then so are the shit mediums, heavies and assaults.

PS: Forgot to say for me assaults are more team reliant on performance – lights make their own game which is a major reason I prefer them solo queue over assaults as I don’t need to rely on my team!

 

LOL I hope that's a good thing! Didn't know I was a particular map explorer hehe...well, other than my "find the bugs" adventures that I don't record.

 

Yep that I can attest to. Happend to me on more then one occasion. Though I can normaly take one or two with me. Not so much in a light.

 

Well, the difference there is that if you're abandoned in an assault, it's not necessarily your fault (unless you were AFK). If you're alone in a light, often it's your own damn fault.

 

Truth....

 

(I'm not sure on the necroing rules here... so my apologies if 2 months is too long to reply)

I'm going to preface this by saying I'm very partial to brawling. A lot of lights support that kind of playstyle. So do a lot of assaults. It was addressed above, but I think that the problem is that you're switching from an assault mech (I only play brawly assault mechs) to the lights best at skirmishing. That kind of style change is something that takes a few matches to get used to for me.

I'd say that giving Firestarters a try would be in your best interest. Either the A or the S are amazing at dealing damage. I'm also partial to the H but it's definitely out of meta right now. They are the only lights that I've found that can reliably pounce on an assault or a heavy and kill it. Usually with taking little damage in return. If your aim is good enough you can usually stand 0m from a Direwolf, usually take out a torso before he knows you're there, and come out on top. Crabs are also fun to jump on because you can stand inside their arm convergence if you do it right. You'll get hit by one side, or the other, but sometimes neither.

I'd also say that Ravens can also be amazing for their ability to hit something really hard and disappear. Some of my favourite light matches were in a 2 ER-Large Laser RVN-3L. The hit boxes aren't as forgiving as the Firestarters, but they are definitely solid and worth a shot. The 2x and 4x also have some pretty amazing quirks behind them. 25%-30% towards various weapons is nothing to sneeze at.

Some people swear by Jenners as well, but I can't agree with it (as my posting in the jenner section can attest, hahaha). They are more hit and fade than jump into a straight brawl. It doesn't work for me right now but it might for you.

 

There was once a time when Jenner was THE light mech to pilot...but since the advent of the Firestarter, their stock has decreased noticeably thanks to their overlarge CT. They are still very capable mechs, but they are no longer the king of lights.

 

I'm entirely willing to agree with this. Power creep seems to be a fairly common thing in this game. I've been paying attention to the reactions that the other teams give them very carefully. It's way over and above the standard "Chase the bunny!" reaction that other lights get. I'm actually guilty of the same. I've noticed that Jenners are easy targets, and I will go out of my way to shoot at them. Rarely does a Firestarter or a Raven warrant the sort of reaction a Jenner gets, even though I'm awful in a Jenner and absolutely lethal in the other 35 ton lights.


There's also a lot to be said about tactics. As an Assault player, the OP has had to have been taken down by lights a few times. Recreating that sort of thing shouldn't be too hard accomplish... you already know what makes an Assault or Heavy pilots life miserable. It's just a question of refining the ability to do that... which calls for practice, practice, and more practice.

 

It's less about power creep (although quirks left the Jenner in the dust a bit) and more about geometry: the Firestarters came out able to run loadouts that were equal to the Jenners, but they have hitboxes that are far superior: the entire torso is thinner and more compact, which means they survive better. The Ember specifically was such a better mech due to its loadout and hitboxes that it made the entire Firestarter chassis worth buying around that hero just to get it mastered vs the Jenner. Quirks might bring the Jenner back to fighting form some day, but its hitboxes will never stop being a major problem.

 

Yeah, unless a huge CT armor/structure quirk is given.

That would be the best for Jenner. And Dragons for example, same problems, got a very big one.

 

I feel like I should put in a plug for the Locusts. I think they are an entirely different animal since quirks. The attribute that Locusts have going for them is their improved acceleration and deceleration. They aren't that much faster in a straight sprint than other lights but they go 0-160-0 faster than anything else.

That means you play with the Locust's acceleration. You are awesome at hill and corner peeking and when using energy weapons with short cooldown (SL, SPL, MPL) you can get into a nice rhythm of rocking in and out of cover while putting a full alpha into an opposing mech without giving them time to react. Often you can do this even when they know you're there because their cooldown is longer and gets out of sync with your movements.

The trick with a Locust is not getting hit at all. If I survive a match it's usually with >90% health. Kind of like a good running back who ducks under or around the big hit from the linebacker, you have to avoid damage as much as possible. In a way, they play the exact opposite of an assault even when in the pack. Always hiding and poking, usually at close range, never confronting anything - at least till the end of the match when you can get a couple of coup de grace.

The fact that they play completely differently than assaults might actually help you because you won't be tempted to engage in any foolish assault behavior when piloting one. If you do there is usually immediate feedback that you made a mistake and you get to spectate for the remainder of the match.